Transcript of NASA Press Conference with Bob Daugherty and Mark Shuart (Part 1)
NASA OFFICE OF PUBLIC AFFAIRS
303 E STREET, S.W., #P
WASHINGTON, D.C. 20546
(202) 358-1600
NASA PRESS CONFERENCE
[1-888-566-9047, Code 19303]
MODERATED BY KEITH HENRY; ACCOMPANIED BY BOB DAUGHERTY AND MARK SHUART
3:07 p.m., Eastern Standard Time
Washington, D.C.
[TRANSCRIPT PREPARED FROM A TELEPHONIC RECORDING.]
P R O C E E D I N G S
JUMP OVER REPORTER ROLL CALL TO START OF TELECON
MR. HENRY: We know Dave Schlick [ph] from the Daily Press is there.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes.
MR. HENRY: And Andy Petkovski [ph], I think I heard your voice. Right?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Can you still hear me?
MR. HENRY: Or A.J. Hostettler [ph] from Times Dispatch.
TELEPHONE CALLER: A.J. is here and listening only.
MR. HENRY: Okay. That is fine.
Tara Morgan, I think I heard you, from Channel 12, Richmond.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yep. I am still here.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Velma Scape [ph] from D.C.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Stale Godding [ph], Keith.
MR. HENRY: Okay, very good. And someone at WAVI-TV?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes. WAVI. Chan is here, listening only.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Listening only.
TELEPHONE CALLER: CNN is monitoring only.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Well, hang on. We will take note of that. I am going through a list here. WTKR-TV Norfolk, you there?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Listening only.
MR. HENRY: Okay, fine.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Keith, this is Andy at the Times Dispatch. Can you hear me?
MR. HENRY: Yes, I can hear you.
Okay. Seth, are you there, from Knight-Ridder?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I am here. I will be asking a question.
MR. HENRY: Okay, all right. I would be disappointed if you didn’t.
Kathy Sawyer from The Washington Post?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Jeff Smith is here from The Washington Post.
MR. HENRY: Okay, all right. Got you down. And I have Eric Pinn [ph] possibly listening in.Warren Leary [ph] from the New York Times?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I am listening in.
MR. HENRY: Okay, very good. Ted Brytus [ph] from AP?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I am here.
MR. HENRY: Okay. And Pauline from AP won’t be with us, as I understand.
Leela Aboud [ph], Wall Street Journal?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yeah, I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Okay, very good. Gwenith Shaw [ph] from Orlando Sentinel?TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes, I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Okay. And either Gwenith or J.S. Hawks is listening in.J.S., are you there?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Tracy Watson from USAToday, I think I heard your voice.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes, indeed. Thanks.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Deborah Zee [ph] from Reuters?
TELEPHONE CALLER: That would be me.
MR. HENRY: Okay, very good. I know how to pronounce “Zee.”
TELEPHONE CALLER: You can do this.
MR. HENRY: Good. Brian Berger, Space News.
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Larry Wheeler, Gannett?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Frank Moring [ph], Aviation Week?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Keith Cowling [ph] from NASA Watch?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Okay, all right. Can’t have too many Keiths.
Andrew Lawler from Science?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Okay. Frank Sitson [ph] from UPI?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Bill Glens [ph] from Washington Times?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes, I’m here.
MR. HENRY: David Cassenbaum [ph], NPR?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Richard Harris is here from NPR.
MR. HENRY: Richard Harris. Okay, very good.
And also, Eric Neeler [ph], is he listening in?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m not sure if he is or not.
MR. HENRY: Jeff Morris from Earth News Daily?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yeah. I’m listening.
MR. HENRY: Tamara Sandana [ph] from Bloomberg? [No response.]
MR. HENRY: Do we have a Bloomberg person?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Betty Rhinart [ph] from Houston Chronicle, or Mark Karow [ph]?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Nick Anderson from the L.A. Times.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Right here.
MR. HENRY: How about Scott Gold, is he listening in?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I don’t believe so.
MR. HENRY: Jeremy Menyay [ph] from Chicago Tribune?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m here, Keith. Thanks.
MR. HENRY: Phil Young, Florida Today?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Chris Krydler [ph] from Florida Today.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Chris. Okay.
And Jim Morris from Dallas Morning News, or Bruce Nickels [ph]?
TELEPHONE CALLER: It is Bruce Nickels here.
MR. HENRY: Okay, very good. Deeann Dyvis [ph] from UPI?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Earl Lange [ph] from Newsday?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yep, I’m here.
MR. HENRY: Fox News, are you there?
[No response.]
TELEPHONE CALLER: Simon Dess [ph], Fox News?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Lisa Stark, ABC?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m here. Thanks, Keith.
MR. HENRY: Bill Harwood, CBS?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yeah, I’m here, Keith.
MR. HENRY: And, CNN, we heard you?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Still here.
MR. HENRY: And Bob, we heard you.
MR. DAUGHERTY: Yep. Got you.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Hey, Keith. Mark Karow from Chronicle in Houston.
MR. HENRY: Okay, got you.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Can you hear me as well? It is Robin Siriano [ph] with the Orlando Sentinel.
MR. HENRY: Let’s see here. Orlando Sentinel. Lois Robinson?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Robin Seriano.
MR. HENRY: Oh, Robin Seriano. Okay. Sorry, Robin.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Keith, this is Irene Brown with Discovery Channel.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Keith, this is Edward Wong with the New York Times.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Hang on, here. New York Times, you said?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yep. Edward Wong.
MR. HENRY: Anybody else out there I missed?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Tony Winton [ph] with AP Broadcast.
TELEPHONE CALLER: And Bob Orr [ph] with CPS.
MR. HENRY: Okay, hang on. AP Broadcast and — sorry. Who was the last one?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Bob Orr with CPS.
MR. HENRY: Bob Orr. Anybody else?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Bill Chen, Earth News.
MR. HENRY: Bill Chen. Anybody else?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Dan Melina [ph] and James Ohberg [ph] from NBC, listening only.
MR. HENRY: Okay, fine.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Jordan Legon from CNN.COM.
MR. HENRY: What was your last name, Jordan?
TELEPHONE CALLER: L-e-g-o-n.
MR. HENRY: CNN.COM. And others?
TELEPHONE CALLER: John [inaudible], Florida State.
MR. HENRY: Anyone else?
[No response.]
MR. HENRY: Okay. Our idea here is that we are going to go down the list, giving a chance to ask one question and a follow-up. Please direct your questions to an individual, if your question is to Bob Daugherty in particular or Mark Shuart in particular.
Each of the participants are going to have a short statement that will be available on the NASA Columbia website after this briefing, and we are going to try to go for about an hour. We will see how that goes. Our goal is to give everyone a chance to ask at least one question, but we will ask you to help move things along so that can happen. Of course, it is critical that everyone mute their phones when they are not speaking so that everyone else can hear, including our radio friends.
It sounds like someone may have come in since we have started. Anyone new come in?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yeah, I came in.
MR. HENRY: And who are you?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Ralph Hardibedian [ph], L.A. Times.
MR. HENRY: I’m sorry. The L.A. Times, and what was the name?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Ralph Hardibedian.
MR. HENRY: Oh, yes. Got you, Ralph.
The other thing that —
TELEPHONE CALLER: We have also got John Schwartz [ph] and Matt Walton, New York Times, listening in.
MR. HENRY: That reminds me of the one guideline that I had forgot to mention. Only one question and follow-up per news organization. So —
TELEPHONE CALLER: This is not a comment on me, is it?
[Laughter.]
MR. HENRY: No, not at all.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Well, if Nick Anderson is already on the line, I am going to defer my question to him.
MR. HENRY: All right, that is fine. However you guys want to play it when you have more than one on the line.
Are there any questions about how we are going to proceed before we start?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Who is present and then some identification of them?
MR. HENRY: We have Bob Daugherty present. Bob is a senior research — Bob is going to give a statement. He is a senior researcher here at Langley.Also on the line is the director of our Structures and Material area, Dr. Mark Shuart, and so that is who — and other people who are present are people from Public Affairs and another person in Bob’s office.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Keith, could you spell Bob and Mark’s last names for me, please?MR. HENRY: Yes. Mark Shuart is S-h-u-a-r-t. Bob Daugherty is D-a-u — with an “a,” notice — D-a-u-g-h-e-r-t-y.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Thank you.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Is “Mark” M-a-r-k or a “c”?
MR. HENRY: With a “k.”
TELEPHONE CALLER: Who else is present from Robert Daugherty’s office?
MR. HENRY: Hard Edelman [ph]. Hard is Bob’s — he’s in the line between Bob and Mark.TELEPHONE CALLER: Is Doug Dwoyer there?
MR. HENRY: No. We are making available Mark Shuart and Bob today for comments.Any other last questions?
TELEPHONE CALLER: I’m sorry. This is Ralph Hardibedian from the L.A. Times. Can you confirm for me that Nick Anderson has already registered?
MR. HENRY: Let’s see here. Yes. Nick is on the line.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yeah, Ralph. I’m here.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Okay, thanks.
MR. HENRY: Can we start now? We are going to do our handful of local media, and then we are going to go to national media, after we have statements from Bob and Mark.
Mark wants to go first. So Mark Shuart is talking next.
MR. SHUART: Good afternoon. My name is Mark Shuart. I am the director for Structures and Materials here at the Langley Research Center.
I would like to open today’s discussion with two background comments. The first comment is that the Langley Research Center is widely recognized for its technical expertise in aerospace. As part of that capability, the NASA Langley Structures and Materials organization has been identified as the agency’s center of excellence in that discipline.
The Structures and Materials organization participated in Orbiter tile research in the early 1980’s and helped analyze the Challenger accident and return-to-shuttle flight.
Recently, an outside organization, the National Transportation Safety Board, sought our expertise, and we are currently assisting them in the accident investigation for American Airlines 587.
My second comment follows the first. The reason we are experts in Structures and Materials is because of our people and our facilities. A fine example of our personnel is Bob Daugherty. Bob has more than 20 years experience in landing dynamics, the area that looks at wheels, landing gear, runways, and how they all interact. He is a senior research engineer and has received several awards for his contributions to human space flight. I trust his judgment because of his demonstrated track record.
It is my pleasure to yield the microphone to Bob Daugherty.
MR. DAUGHERTY: Thanks, Mark.
My name is Bob Daugherty, and I am a senior research engineer here at Langley Research Center where I have worked for almost 23 years.
At the Aircraft Landing Dynamics facility, we do research on advanced landing gear systems. We characterize aircraft and spacecraft takeoff and landing performance with mathematical models to describe things like steering and braking friction, and we work from time to time on solving operational problems for a number of commercial and other governmental agencies. In one form or another, I have worked on shuttle tire and landing issues for about 18 years.
First, let me say that I don’t know what caused the Columbia tragedy, but I do firmly believe the Columbia Accident Investigation Board will figure out the cause and offer solutions to prevent it from happening again. I feel like everyone at NASA that we owe this to the families and to the public.
Second, why I am speaking with you today, honestly I was very surprised by the attention my writing received. I view my involvement as a small sideline focused on landing issues, and I have been in somewhat of a quandary. I really do believe that the best thing I can do for the investigation is to talk to the investigative board first.
On the other hand, it is frustrating that my words are being misinterpreted. My quandary has now been relieved since the board has said they don’t mind if I speak up. So I want to clear the air as much as possible, and I hope you will excuse me in advance if we get into any technical areas where I may still feel it is best to talk to the board first.
Finally, before taking questions, I would just like to mention what I consider my most important point, and that is my intention with my e-mails. I was asked a question from a longtime friend and colleague about whether we had ever simulated a landing with two flat tires. After some thinking, I believe that that was the wrong question. The thing that might get you in that predicament would manifest itself long before you got to the runway.
And I simply wanted to present the whole range of issues between catastrophe and a perfect landing. I wanted to make sure that everybody could be as ready as possible for any eventuality. The e-mail was intended to spark discussion to ensure if there were such plans, and I believe they did just that.
With that, I think we will be able to take questions.
MR. HENRY: Okay. Dave Schlick, Newport News Daily Press, first question.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes. This is Dave, directed towards Mr. Daugherty.
What were you doing on the morning of February 1st, and when you heard Columbia was lost and maybe later you heard the radio communications by Jeff Kling saying “We just lost tire pressure on both tires,” did you think of your e-mails? Did you think your scenarios may have come true, and if not, what were you thinking that morning?
MR. DAUGHERTY: I try to watch every landing and launch, and I had come into the office that Saturday morning to be able to watch the NASA channel. And I got there, gees, just a few minutes before 9:00 a.m. So I was watching it on the NASA channel, did not hear the comments in real time on losing sensors and so forth.
I guess the first time that something looked out of the ordinary to me was when they were doing more com checks than normal, and by the time I had heard the statement that they had not seen anything on the Merit Island radar, you know, that was a troubling time.Have I answered your question?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Well, in everything that you have read and heard since the disaster, do you have any thoughts as to whether some of your scenarios are still as a possibility as the cause of the disaster?
MR. DAUGHERTY: Well, you know, certainly that is the first thing that ran through my mind, and I was certainly hoping that something like that had not occurred. Of course, we still just don’t know, but, yeah, that is the first thing that ran through my mind when something was apparently seriously missed.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Okay. And to follow up, could I ask, your e-mail seemed to be one step away from reaching Bill Ready, and this is a question maybe Mark and Bob could answer. Do you wish now that it had reached a higher level of NASA, and do you think it should have reached a higher level, why or why not?
MR. DAUGHERTY: This is Bob.
I think the way to answer that, first of all, is do I think it should have, rather than “wish,” and I don’t think it should have.
My e-mail was technical issues that I intended to have technical people discuss, and that is exactly what happened. So, in my estimation, it went exactly where I intended it and where I thought it should be.
MR. SHUART: This is Mark.
I followed exactly what Bob was — followed closely what Bob was doing, and it looked like all was being taken care of at his level, which typically is the way we try to resolve things.
MR. HENRY: Thank you, Dave.
Andy Petkovski from the Richmond Times Dispatch?
TELEPHONE CALLER: Yes. Hi. Can you hear me?
MR. HENRY: Yes.
TELEPHONE CALLER: From reading the e-mails, Bob, it seems that there is sort of a level of concern beyond just discussing possibilities, and I was wondering at the time you wrote those e-mails whether the scenarios you were outlining seemed more than hypothetical and you were feeling real concern that disaster may be on the way.
Several times, you mentioned potential endings of not a good day or a catastrophe, and were you getting — by the time you e-mailed your bosses, did you feel that you really had — that there was a genuine possibility that what happened would happen?
MR. DAUGHERTY: Yeah. Thanks, Andy.
Frankly, no. There really wasn’t a level of concern. I know you can get that from the e-mails, but these were, you know, e-mails between longtime colleagues. So we spent a lot of time talking in the e-mails like we might talk in person, and there was not concern from my standpoint in the e-mails, had no clue whatever that the analysis might or might not be right. We were simply looking into, well, let’s be conservative, what if the analysis weren’t right, let’s think of the things that you might want to plan for and have a game plan in your back pocket.
TELEPHONE CALLER: If I can follow up, when you expressed concern that certain simulations be done where the models were already set up, did you — how much did it matter to you that it be performed?
MR. DAUGHERTY: It mattered a lot to me. If you had any dealings with engineers, you will find they are always looking over your shoulders impatient, and as any engineer who wants information, we always think what we want is the most important thing at the time. Since we have been asked about landing with two flat tires and that was the mechanism by which we could get the answers, sure, I was impatient to get those things done, and some of that impatience, you know, came out in the e-mails, but it wasn’t concern because I felt there were any real problems. It was simply impatience to get the answers that I wanted to be able to pass forward.
MR. HENRY: Tom Morgan, Channel 12, Richmond.
I will remind everyone to mute when you have the opportunity.
TELEPHONE CALLER: Can you hear me, Keith?
MR. HENRY: Yes.
